Re: [PCW] PCW Trawlercat
Hi Jeff,
I've been away for a week and just discovered your blog and I don't see that
you received a response, so I'm going to let the cat out of the bag.
Trawlercat Marine is a dedicated power catamaran design company and I
pioneered the trawler power catamaran concept in 1997 when I first set up my
design business in Canada. We are not a boat builder, although I was a boat
builder in Australia where I had my own company and built 20' power
catamarans that I designed back in the late 1970's. We tried to build our
trawler catamarans for a fixed price as semi-production boats, but the
builders we chose to build them found it difficult to show a profit as
prices increased over a 12 month build period and the boats were actually
being custom built for more than the builder quoted. We now only have them
built as custom power catamarans with reputable builders in the USA and
Canada just as many other boat designers do.
I became a partner with John Shaw in Oregon when our company was called
Pacific Coast Boats, which as I was to discover was only one of 8 or more
different companies Shaw has run and closed down over the last 20 years due
to his bad management. As an Australian I had to obtain a work visa to stay
in Oregon but once Shaw had all my design information he withdrew his
sponsorship for my visa and it was refused, which left me in Canada and
unable to see what he was up to in Oregon.
Shaw soon found himself another partner and started up a new company,
Pacific Expedition Yachts, using the Trawlercat Marine design information
and the hull mold and other tooling that we jointly owned and which he stole
from me. To try to gain what he believes is some legitimacy with the stolen
Trawlercat Marine design information he had an Australian designer tweek the
layout so he can say they are his designs and he plays this for all he can
get out of it on his web site.
Patrick Meyer:
On June 14, 2007, Pat Meyer, the new business partner with Shaw in Pacific
Expedition Yachts wrote to TrawlerCat Marine seeking information on a TCM
55' power catamaran he would like us to build for him. Twenty one pages of
emailed question, answers and more pages of attached drawings, photos and
other information passed between us before Pat disappeared off the radar
screen. Less than 6 months later Pat Meyer appeared as a partner with John
Shaw in Pacific Expedition Yachts.
It should be noted here that in Pat Meyer's first ever email to me at
TrawlerCat Marine in June 2007 he stated, "I should mention I do not no
diddly about boats, my goal is to learn and learn a lot."
Pat now states in the Pacific Expedition Yachts web site, "We build for and
consult with our clients from a strong 20 year foundation of knowing of what
really works on both open and protected waters around the world." We; of
course meaning him and John Shaw. I'm just curious as to where they gained
this knowledge of what really works on a power catamaran on both open and
protected waters around the world when neither of them has really operated a
power catamaran anywhere. Could both these men be misinforming the boating
public? Is their whole business a sham? It certainly appears so.
The 45' power catamaran Shaw launched in June 2009 is my TCM 45'. I brought
the customer, Bill Fleenor, to John Shaw at Pacific Coast Boats to build it
and a TCM 65' for another client. We started building the 45' in June 2005
and the 65' in October 2005, that's four years to almost, but not quite,
complete a 45' boat that should have taken one year to build and who knows
how long it will be before he completes the 65'.
A note on the Pacific Expedition Yachts web site states, "Just a quick
update. A new PE60 will join the Pacific Expedition Yachts family in 2010
with construction set to finish in early 2011." Based on over 4 years to
build the TCM 45' and the still to be completed TCM 65' I have very serious
doubts that they will complete this boat on time.
On one of my visits to Pacific Coast Boats I noticed that Shaw had painted
cardboard with black paint, then cut it out to look like windows and port
lights and attached it to the TCM 45'. He then took photos to show the
customer the work that had been completed on his boat. What Shaw was doing
was committing fraud by showing the customer photos of work that was faked
so he could ask for the next payment.
What happens in this situation, and Shaw plays this very well, he sucks the
customer along faking things and sending them photos of work supposedly
completed to get the next payment. Once they've paid in enough money he
tells them they'll lose everything if they don't pay more for him to finish
their boat as he'll have to close down the business. So the customer is
left with very little choice but to keep paying or lose hundreds of
thousands of dollars and only have a half finished boat to show for it.
This is how he has operated for over 20 years, Rod Gibbons a forum member
can verify how Shaw operates and so can Kurt Hughes a catamaran designer and
many, many other people Shaw has ripped off or owes money to. I can provide
contact details of these people to anyone who would like to verify my
information.
John Shaw handled all the purchasing and the banking but went through his
'banker friend' in Washington State. He wouldn't let me see the information
saying he kept it at home so he could work on it on weekends and that
everything was okay and I couldn't do the banking anyway because I wasn't a
US Citizen.
I contacted our company accountant in Oregon and visited his office to find
out how the business was 'really' doing. That's when our accountant told me
that Shaw hadn't paid his account for the last six months work he had done
for him and he was quite concerned.
Our landlord, the Toledo Harbor Manager, told me Shaw was 3 months behind on
the rent and he said the Harbor Authority was threatening to kick him out of
the building.
One of the biggest problems I had with Shaw was that he left his
inexperienced Mexican crew to do things on the TCM 45' boat while he and
some experienced Mexican workers went off to do cash jobs on other boats.
Shaw pocketed the money from these jobs but paid the workers and made
purchasers for this work through Pacific Coast Boats, seriously depleting
our finances. Without a full work crew the TCM 45' boat was taking so long
to build that the overheads eventually took away all the profit. With no
profit left in the boat, Shaw then has to squeeze the customer for more
money to eventually finish the boat, or if he signs up another customer for
a new boat and receives a deposit he uses their deposit money to finish the
first boat. This is called catch-up boat building and is a sign of bad
management and it always leads to disaster and someone, not Shaw, losing a
lot of money.
Shaw gets away with this MO time and time again because of the cost of legal
action in the USA and the years of grief involved dealing with lawyers and
courts in trying to sue him and of course he claims he has no money to sue
him for anyway, so what's the point. Unfortunately almost all of his
customers lose money in the process and finish up with an unfinished boat.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it is about time someone stood up to
John Shaw and exposes him for what he is so that no more innocent people
will get hurt.
Graham
Captain Graham Pfister
President & Lead Designer
Trawlercat Marine Designs
www.trawlercatmarine.com http://www.trawlercatmarine.com/
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:20:21 -0500
From: "Jeff" scubadoggy@comcast.net
To: "'Power Catamaran List'" power-catamaran@lists.samurai.com
Subject: [PCW] Trawler Cat...
Message-ID: 03d301ca9b09$734e4240$59eac6c0$@net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
I just took a look at the www.trawlercatmarine.com site, I've never seen
them before...
Looks pretty good, but has anyone ever compared them to
www.pacificexpedition.com? Not sure which one is better... Anyone know
prices for the trawlercat 43?
Jeff
Power-Catamaran Mailing List
Power-Catamaran Mailing List
End of Power-Catamaran Digest, Vol 57, Issue 18
Thanks Graham, that adds some insight to the matter!
Jeff
-----Original Message-----
From: power-catamaran-bounces+scubadoggy=comcast.net@lists.samurai.com
[mailto:power-catamaran-bounces+scubadoggy=comcast.net@lists.samurai.com] On
Behalf Of Graham
Sent: Thursday, January 28, 2010 6:26 PM
To: power-catamaran@lists.samurai.com
Subject: Re: [PCW] PCW Trawlercat
Hi Jeff,
I've been away for a week and just discovered your blog and I don't see that
you received a response, so I'm going to let the cat out of the bag.
Trawlercat Marine is a dedicated power catamaran design company and I
pioneered the trawler power catamaran concept in 1997 when I first set up my
design business in Canada. We are not a boat builder, although I was a boat
builder in Australia where I had my own company and built 20' power
catamarans that I designed back in the late 1970's. We tried to build our
trawler catamarans for a fixed price as semi-production boats, but the
builders we chose to build them found it difficult to show a profit as
prices increased over a 12 month build period and the boats were actually
being custom built for more than the builder quoted. We now only have them
built as custom power catamarans with reputable builders in the USA and
Canada just as many other boat designers do.
I became a partner with John Shaw in Oregon when our company was called
Pacific Coast Boats, which as I was to discover was only one of 8 or more
different companies Shaw has run and closed down over the last 20 years due
to his bad management. As an Australian I had to obtain a work visa to stay
in Oregon but once Shaw had all my design information he withdrew his
sponsorship for my visa and it was refused, which left me in Canada and
unable to see what he was up to in Oregon.
Shaw soon found himself another partner and started up a new company,
Pacific Expedition Yachts, using the Trawlercat Marine design information
and the hull mold and other tooling that we jointly owned and which he stole
from me. To try to gain what he believes is some legitimacy with the stolen
Trawlercat Marine design information he had an Australian designer tweek the
layout so he can say they are his designs and he plays this for all he can
get out of it on his web site.
Patrick Meyer:
On June 14, 2007, Pat Meyer, the new business partner with Shaw in Pacific
Expedition Yachts wrote to TrawlerCat Marine seeking information on a TCM
55' power catamaran he would like us to build for him. Twenty one pages of
emailed question, answers and more pages of attached drawings, photos and
other information passed between us before Pat disappeared off the radar
screen. Less than 6 months later Pat Meyer appeared as a partner with John
Shaw in Pacific Expedition Yachts.
It should be noted here that in Pat Meyer's first ever email to me at
TrawlerCat Marine in June 2007 he stated, "I should mention I do not no
diddly about boats, my goal is to learn and learn a lot."
Pat now states in the Pacific Expedition Yachts web site, "We build for and
consult with our clients from a strong 20 year foundation of knowing of what
really works on both open and protected waters around the world." We; of
course meaning him and John Shaw. I'm just curious as to where they gained
this knowledge of what really works on a power catamaran on both open and
protected waters around the world when neither of them has really operated a
power catamaran anywhere. Could both these men be misinforming the boating
public? Is their whole business a sham? It certainly appears so.
The 45' power catamaran Shaw launched in June 2009 is my TCM 45'. I brought
the customer, Bill Fleenor, to John Shaw at Pacific Coast Boats to build it
and a TCM 65' for another client. We started building the 45' in June 2005
and the 65' in October 2005, that's four years to almost, but not quite,
complete a 45' boat that should have taken one year to build and who knows
how long it will be before he completes the 65'.
A note on the Pacific Expedition Yachts web site states, "Just a quick
update. A new PE60 will join the Pacific Expedition Yachts family in 2010
with construction set to finish in early 2011." Based on over 4 years to
build the TCM 45' and the still to be completed TCM 65' I have very serious
doubts that they will complete this boat on time.
On one of my visits to Pacific Coast Boats I noticed that Shaw had painted
cardboard with black paint, then cut it out to look like windows and port
lights and attached it to the TCM 45'. He then took photos to show the
customer the work that had been completed on his boat. What Shaw was doing
was committing fraud by showing the customer photos of work that was faked
so he could ask for the next payment.
What happens in this situation, and Shaw plays this very well, he sucks the
customer along faking things and sending them photos of work supposedly
completed to get the next payment. Once they've paid in enough money he
tells them they'll lose everything if they don't pay more for him to finish
their boat as he'll have to close down the business. So the customer is
left with very little choice but to keep paying or lose hundreds of
thousands of dollars and only have a half finished boat to show for it.
This is how he has operated for over 20 years, Rod Gibbons a forum member
can verify how Shaw operates and so can Kurt Hughes a catamaran designer and
many, many other people Shaw has ripped off or owes money to. I can provide
contact details of these people to anyone who would like to verify my
information.
John Shaw handled all the purchasing and the banking but went through his
'banker friend' in Washington State. He wouldn't let me see the information
saying he kept it at home so he could work on it on weekends and that
everything was okay and I couldn't do the banking anyway because I wasn't a
US Citizen.
I contacted our company accountant in Oregon and visited his office to find
out how the business was 'really' doing. That's when our accountant told me
that Shaw hadn't paid his account for the last six months work he had done
for him and he was quite concerned.
Our landlord, the Toledo Harbor Manager, told me Shaw was 3 months behind on
the rent and he said the Harbor Authority was threatening to kick him out of
the building.
One of the biggest problems I had with Shaw was that he left his
inexperienced Mexican crew to do things on the TCM 45' boat while he and
some experienced Mexican workers went off to do cash jobs on other boats.
Shaw pocketed the money from these jobs but paid the workers and made
purchasers for this work through Pacific Coast Boats, seriously depleting
our finances. Without a full work crew the TCM 45' boat was taking so long
to build that the overheads eventually took away all the profit. With no
profit left in the boat, Shaw then has to squeeze the customer for more
money to eventually finish the boat, or if he signs up another customer for
a new boat and receives a deposit he uses their deposit money to finish the
first boat. This is called catch-up boat building and is a sign of bad
management and it always leads to disaster and someone, not Shaw, losing a
lot of money.
Shaw gets away with this MO time and time again because of the cost of legal
action in the USA and the years of grief involved dealing with lawyers and
courts in trying to sue him and of course he claims he has no money to sue
him for anyway, so what's the point. Unfortunately almost all of his
customers lose money in the process and finish up with an unfinished boat.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it is about time someone stood up to
John Shaw and exposes him for what he is so that no more innocent people
will get hurt.
Graham
Captain Graham Pfister
President & Lead Designer
Trawlercat Marine Designs
www.trawlercatmarine.com http://www.trawlercatmarine.com/
Message: 7
Date: Thu, 21 Jan 2010 21:20:21 -0500
From: "Jeff" scubadoggy@comcast.net
To: "'Power Catamaran List'" power-catamaran@lists.samurai.com
Subject: [PCW] Trawler Cat...
Message-ID: 03d301ca9b09$734e4240$59eac6c0$@net
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Hi,
I just took a look at the www.trawlercatmarine.com site, I've never seen
them before...
Looks pretty good, but has anyone ever compared them to
www.pacificexpedition.com? Not sure which one is better... Anyone know
prices for the trawlercat 43?
Jeff
Power-Catamaran Mailing List
Power-Catamaran Mailing List
End of Power-Catamaran Digest, Vol 57, Issue 18
Power-Catamaran Mailing List