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Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement

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Re: What's the best HP OCXO for frequency counter reference?

HM
Hal Murray
Tue, Jun 28, 2022 8:15 PM

Adrian Godwin said:

If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home GPSDO,
how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power /
temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it there ?

You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car accessory
socket.

How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to car to
table effect the frequency?

--
These are my opinions.  I hate spam.

Adrian Godwin said: > If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home GPSDO, > how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power / > temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it there ? You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car accessory socket. How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to car to table effect the frequency? -- These are my opinions. I hate spam.
BK
Bob kb8tq
Tue, Jun 28, 2022 10:20 PM

Hi

On Jun 28, 2022, at 12:15 PM, Hal Murray via time-nuts time-nuts@lists.febo.com wrote:

Adrian Godwin said:

If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home GPSDO,
how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power /
temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it there ?

You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car accessory
socket.

You still power it down doing that. Power cycle generally isn’t a good idea if you
are after good stability.

How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to car to
table effect the frequency?

If you flip it end for end you might be measuring the “2g tip” acceleration sensitivity :).
That could be up in the 1 to 2 ppb range. Shock and vibe is very much a “that depends”
sort of thing. You could (but probably won’t) see a couple of ppb.

The biggest issue is going to be the changing temperature environment. Thermal shock
is going to create a bigger change than simple temperature change. Going from inside
to outside to car to outside to inside …. each one is a relatively fast change. You might
have a device that held a ppb in a normal temp test and it changes 10X that (or more)
when hit with a relatively modest “fast change”.

Just what’s fast and how much of a change you get is very much a “that depends” sort
of thing. Leave the cover off your OCXO mechanical trimmer and you could find that it
is very sensitive to a gentle gust of wind from the wrong direction ….

Bob

--
These are my opinions.  I hate spam.


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Hi > On Jun 28, 2022, at 12:15 PM, Hal Murray via time-nuts <time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote: > > > Adrian Godwin said: >> If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home GPSDO, >> how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power / >> temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it there ? > > You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car accessory > socket. You still power it down doing that. Power cycle generally isn’t a good idea if you are after good stability. > > How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to car to > table effect the frequency? If you flip it end for end you might be measuring the “2g tip” acceleration sensitivity :). That could be up in the 1 to 2 ppb range. Shock and vibe is very much a “that depends” sort of thing. You could (but probably won’t) see a couple of ppb. The biggest issue is going to be the changing temperature environment. Thermal shock is going to create a bigger change than simple temperature change. Going from inside to outside to car to outside to inside …. each one is a relatively fast change. You might have a device that held a ppb in a normal temp test and it changes 10X that (or more) when hit with a relatively modest “fast change”. Just what’s fast and how much of a change you get is very much a “that depends” sort of thing. Leave the cover off your OCXO mechanical trimmer and you could find that it is very sensitive to a gentle gust of wind from the wrong direction …. Bob > > > -- > These are my opinions. I hate spam. > > > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe send an email to time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com
JN
Jeremy Nichols
Tue, Jun 28, 2022 11:30 PM

OCXOs generally don’t require a lot of power. A small (portable size) UPS
can keep the OCXO powered up while on the move. With an appropriate
inverter, the UPS can be powered by a vehicle. Think “flying clock” of
years ago.

On Tue, Jun 28, 2022 at 3:59 PM Bob kb8tq via time-nuts <
time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote:

Hi

On Jun 28, 2022, at 12:15 PM, Hal Murray via time-nuts <

Adrian Godwin said:

If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home

GPSDO,

how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power /
temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it

there ?

You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car

accessory

socket.

You still power it down doing that. Power cycle generally isn’t a good
idea if you
are after good stability.

How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to

car to

table effect the frequency?

If you flip it end for end you might be measuring the “2g tip”
acceleration sensitivity :).
That could be up in the 1 to 2 ppb range. Shock and vibe is very much a
“that depends”
sort of thing. You could (but probably won’t) see a couple of ppb.

The biggest issue is going to be the changing temperature environment.
Thermal shock
is going to create a bigger change than simple temperature change. Going
from inside
to outside to car to outside to inside …. each one is a relatively fast
change. You might
have a device that held a ppb in a normal temp test and it changes 10X
that (or more)
when hit with a relatively modest “fast change”.

Just what’s fast and how much of a change you get is very much a “that
depends” sort
of thing. Leave the cover off your OCXO mechanical trimmer and you could
find that it
is very sensitive to a gentle gust of wind from the wrong direction ….

Bob

--
These are my opinions.  I hate spam.


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--
Jeremy Nichols
Sent from my iPad 6.

OCXOs generally don’t require a lot of power. A small (portable size) UPS can keep the OCXO powered up while on the move. With an appropriate inverter, the UPS can be powered by a vehicle. Think “flying clock” of years ago. On Tue, Jun 28, 2022 at 3:59 PM Bob kb8tq via time-nuts < time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote: > Hi > > > > On Jun 28, 2022, at 12:15 PM, Hal Murray via time-nuts < > time-nuts@lists.febo.com> wrote: > > > > > > Adrian Godwin said: > >> If you use the ovened oscillator for temporary use away from the home > GPSDO, > >> how good will the oscillator be with those interruptions to power / > >> temperature, and will it stabilise during the period you're using it > there ? > > > > You can solve that with a UPS and/or a gizmo that plugs into a car > accessory > > socket. > > You still power it down doing that. Power cycle generally isn’t a good > idea if you > are after good stability. > > > > > How much does the mechanical jostling as gear gets moved from bench to > car to > > table effect the frequency? > > If you flip it end for end you might be measuring the “2g tip” > acceleration sensitivity :). > That could be up in the 1 to 2 ppb range. Shock and vibe is very much a > “that depends” > sort of thing. You could (but probably won’t) see a couple of ppb. > > The biggest issue is going to be the changing temperature environment. > Thermal shock > is going to create a bigger change than simple temperature change. Going > from inside > to outside to car to outside to inside …. each one is a relatively fast > change. You might > have a device that held a ppb in a normal temp test and it changes 10X > that (or more) > when hit with a relatively modest “fast change”. > > Just what’s fast and how much of a change you get is very much a “that > depends” sort > of thing. Leave the cover off your OCXO mechanical trimmer and you could > find that it > is very sensitive to a gentle gust of wind from the wrong direction …. > > Bob > > > > > > > -- > > These are my opinions. I hate spam. > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > > To unsubscribe send an email to time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@lists.febo.com > To unsubscribe send an email to time-nuts-leave@lists.febo.com -- Jeremy Nichols Sent from my iPad 6.