ctbirds@lists.ctbirding.org

For discussing birds and birding in Connecticut

View all threads

Snowy Owl discussion

JC
Joseph Cala
Fri, Dec 6, 2013 12:44 AM

All-

Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic.  I was going
to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but
felt it best not to make a novel out of my post.

The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this
year's irruption.  Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of
food, but the question is why is there a lack of food.  In doing some
research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a
typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms
Snowy's routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests
16!).  If there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be
conservatively looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking
for food.  Based on the pictures and reports from various states it
surely appears that a very large percentage of the irrupted birds are
juveniles--this would tend to suggest the irruption is in fact due to
very successful clutch/hatchling results.  I realize that it's
frustrating seeing these birds not doing well, but keep in mind they are
a species of Least Concern and have a fairly stable population estimate
of 300,000.

A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been
brought up.  I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by
using 'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior
logic.  Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they
consider to be a threat for prolonged periods of time.  I think it also
needs to be brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and
many of these birds have never seen humans--they very well may not
consider people as a threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic
fox, eagle, etc.

I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on
the extreme side.  As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere)
Snowy Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions,
and genuinely enjoy the view.  I showed several people at work
(definitely non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they
were astounded that such a creature even existed--and said they would
love to see one.  Exposure and added interest to birding is only going
to increase awareness and support down the road.

Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless
times--what exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy
Owl?  And why the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl
but it's perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25
feet from a Fork-tailed Flycatcher?

All- Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic. I was going to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but felt it best not to make a novel out of my post. The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this year's irruption. Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of food, but the question is why is there a lack of food. In doing some research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms Snowy's routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests 16!). If there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be conservatively looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking for food. Based on the pictures and reports from various states it surely appears that a very large percentage of the irrupted birds are juveniles--this would tend to suggest the irruption is in fact due to very successful clutch/hatchling results. I realize that it's frustrating seeing these birds not doing well, but keep in mind they are a species of Least Concern and have a fairly stable population estimate of 300,000. A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been brought up. I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by using 'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior logic. Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they consider to be a threat for prolonged periods of time. I think it also needs to be brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and many of these birds have never seen humans--they very well may not consider people as a threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic fox, eagle, etc. I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on the extreme side. As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere) Snowy Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions, and genuinely enjoy the view. I showed several people at work (definitely non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they were astounded that such a creature even existed--and said they would love to see one. Exposure and added interest to birding is only going to increase awareness and support down the road. Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless times--what exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy Owl? And why the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl but it's perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25 feet from a Fork-tailed Flycatcher?
AS
Arthur Shippee
Fri, Dec 6, 2013 1:27 AM

Thanks, Joseph, for helpful information and comment.  Your point that the preponderance of juveniles here suggests nesting over-success is interesting.  (I suppose that's one way populations can spread, when there's opportunity.)  I'm a bit surprised that no one seems to know off-hand if there was a surplus of food early:  surely someone's monitoring this?

Not considering humans as threats, given their normal range:  a plausible observation, along with their being juveniles.

What's too close?  Good question.  While I suppose we'd best like to err on the side of caution, your point about its being a teaching moment for non-birders is well-taken.

On Dec 5, 2013, at 7:44 PM, Joseph Cala Joejr14@aol.com wrote:

All-

Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic.  I was going to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but felt it best not to make a novel out of my post.

The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this year's irruption.  Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of food, but the question is why is there a lack of food.  In doing some research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms Snowy's routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests 16!).  If there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be conservatively looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking for food.  Based on the pictures and reports from various states it surely appears that a very large percentage of the irrupted birds are juveniles--this would tend to suggest the irruption is in fact due to very successful clutch/hatchling results.  I realize that it's frustrating seeing these birds not doing well, but keep in mind they are a species of Least Concern and have a fairly stable population estimate of 300,000.

A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been brought up.  I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by using 'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior logic.  Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they consider to be a threat for prolonged periods of time.  I think it also needs to be brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and many of these birds have never seen humans--they very well may not consider people as a threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic fox, eagle, etc.

I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on the extreme side.  As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere) Snowy Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions, and genuinely enjoy the view.  I showed several people at work (definitely non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they were astounded that such a creature even existed--and said they would love to see one.  Exposure and added interest to birding is only going to increase awareness and support down the road.

Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless times--what exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy Owl?  And why the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl but it's perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25 feet from a Fork-tailed Flycatcher?


This list is provided by the Connecticut Ornithological Association (COA) for the discussion of birds and birding in Connecticut.
For subscription information visit http://lists.ctbirding.org/mailman/listinfo/ctbirds_lists.ctbirding.org

Thanks, Joseph, for helpful information and comment. Your point that the preponderance of juveniles here suggests nesting over-success is interesting. (I suppose that's one way populations can spread, when there's opportunity.) I'm a bit surprised that no one seems to know off-hand if there was a surplus of food early: surely someone's monitoring this? Not considering humans as threats, given their normal range: a plausible observation, along with their being juveniles. What's too close? Good question. While I suppose we'd best like to err on the side of caution, your point about its being a teaching moment for non-birders is well-taken. On Dec 5, 2013, at 7:44 PM, Joseph Cala <Joejr14@aol.com> wrote: > All- > > Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic. I was going to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but felt it best not to make a novel out of my post. > > The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this year's irruption. Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of food, but the question is why is there a lack of food. In doing some research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms Snowy's routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests 16!). If there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be conservatively looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking for food. Based on the pictures and reports from various states it surely appears that a very large percentage of the irrupted birds are juveniles--this would tend to suggest the irruption is in fact due to very successful clutch/hatchling results. I realize that it's frustrating seeing these birds not doing well, but keep in mind they are a species of Least Concern and have a fairly stable population estimate of 300,000. > > A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been brought up. I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by using 'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior logic. Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they consider to be a threat for prolonged periods of time. I think it also needs to be brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and many of these birds have never seen humans--they very well may not consider people as a threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic fox, eagle, etc. > > I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on the extreme side. As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere) Snowy Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions, and genuinely enjoy the view. I showed several people at work (definitely non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they were astounded that such a creature even existed--and said they would love to see one. Exposure and added interest to birding is only going to increase awareness and support down the road. > > Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless times--what exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy Owl? And why the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl but it's perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25 feet from a Fork-tailed Flycatcher? > > _______________________________________________ > This list is provided by the Connecticut Ornithological Association (COA) for the discussion of birds and birding in Connecticut. > For subscription information visit http://lists.ctbirding.org/mailman/listinfo/ctbirds_lists.ctbirding.org
KB
Kevin Burgio
Fri, Dec 6, 2013 1:41 AM

All,

In preparing for my Ph.D. qualifying exam, I have been reading a great deal
on the subject of human-caused stress responses in birds, and want to add
some of the things that I have learned to this discussion. I'll be brief.
I'll also preface this by saying that I do not have any answers /
suggestions about what should be done.  I just thought that some of you,
reading about this subject in interest, would like to know a little about
the research done on this topic.

  1. Birds may not change their outward behavior but can be stressed in the
    presence of humans, demonstrated by increased heart rate, and etc.
    (Weimerskirch et al. 2002).
  2. Birds that are used to human presence, as well as their offspring, have
    lower stress hormone responses to subsequent human presence (Walker et al.
  1. Birds on starvation diets already have elevated levels of stress
    hormones in their body, which not only has short-term effects (both
    positive and negative), but in the case of young birds, increased levels of
    stress hormones, while young, can negatively impact their life-long
    development, learning ability, foraging capacity, and life-long fitness
    (Walker et al. 2005, Bertram and Hanson 2002).

If anyone is interested in reading the primary literature I cited here, I
will be happy to send the PDFs your way.  I hope you all found this helpful.

Best,
Kevin Burgio
Hamden

On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 7:44 PM, Joseph Cala Joejr14@aol.com wrote:

All-

Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic.  I was going
to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but felt
it best not to make a novel out of my post.

The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this
year's irruption.  Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of
food, but the question is why is there a lack of food.  In doing some
research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a
typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms Snowy's
routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests 16!).  If
there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be conservatively
looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking for food.  Based on
the pictures and reports from various states it surely appears that a very
large percentage of the irrupted birds are juveniles--this would tend to
suggest the irruption is in fact due to very successful clutch/hatchling
results.  I realize that it's frustrating seeing these birds not doing
well, but keep in mind they are a species of Least Concern and have a
fairly stable population estimate of 300,000.

A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been
brought up.  I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by using
'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior logic.
Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they consider to
be a threat for prolonged periods of time.  I think it also needs to be
brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and many of these
birds have never seen humans--they very well may not consider people as a
threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic fox, eagle, etc.

I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on
the extreme side.  As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere) Snowy
Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions, and
genuinely enjoy the view.  I showed several people at work (definitely
non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they were astounded
that such a creature even existed--and said they would love to see one.
Exposure and added interest to birding is only going to increase awareness
and support down the road.

Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless times--what
exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy Owl?  And why
the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl but it's
perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25 feet from a
Fork-tailed Flycatcher?


This list is provided by the Connecticut Ornithological Association (COA)
for the discussion of birds and birding in Connecticut.
For subscription information visit http://lists.ctbirding.org/
mailman/listinfo/ctbirds_lists.ctbirding.org

--
Kevin R. Burgio  @KRBurgio https://twitter.com/KRBurgio
Ph.D. Student
NSF Graduate Research Fellow
University of Connecticut
Ecology and Evolutionary Biology Dept
kevin.burgio@uconn.edu
(860) 486-3839
Monk Parakeet Research Website http://www.eeb.uconn.edu/people/burgio
Facebook Parakeet Research
Pagehttps://www.facebook.com/ConnecticutMonkParakeetResearch?ref=hl
Curriculum vitaehttp://hydrodictyon.eeb.uconn.edu/eebedia/images/b/bb/Burgio_CV2.pdf

All, In preparing for my Ph.D. qualifying exam, I have been reading a great deal on the subject of human-caused stress responses in birds, and want to add some of the things that I have learned to this discussion. I'll be brief. I'll also preface this by saying that I do not have any answers / suggestions about what should be done. I just thought that some of you, reading about this subject in interest, would like to know a little about the research done on this topic. 1. Birds may not change their outward behavior but can be stressed in the presence of humans, demonstrated by increased heart rate, and etc. (Weimerskirch et al. 2002). 2. Birds that are used to human presence, as well as their offspring, have lower stress hormone responses to subsequent human presence (Walker et al. 2005) 3. Birds on starvation diets already have elevated levels of stress hormones in their body, which not only has short-term effects (both positive and negative), but in the case of young birds, increased levels of stress hormones, while young, can negatively impact their life-long development, learning ability, foraging capacity, and life-long fitness (Walker et al. 2005, Bertram and Hanson 2002). If anyone is interested in reading the primary literature I cited here, I will be happy to send the PDFs your way. I hope you all found this helpful. Best, Kevin Burgio Hamden On Thu, Dec 5, 2013 at 7:44 PM, Joseph Cala <Joejr14@aol.com> wrote: > All- > > Interesting continuing conversation on the Snowy Owl topic. I was going > to get into some of what Keith posted in my post the other night, but felt > it best not to make a novel out of my post. > > The fact is there is really no way to 100% determine the cause of this > year's irruption. Obviously there reason for the irruption is a lack of > food, but the question is why is there a lack of food. In doing some > research for my post last night I found numerous sources that stated a > typical Snowy Owl clutch is a few birds--and during lemming booms Snowy's > routinely will have clutches of up to SEVEN (AlaskaZoo suggests 16!). If > there was a lemming boom this past summer, we could be conservatively > looking at up to 5x the amount of young Snowy's looking for food. Based on > the pictures and reports from various states it surely appears that a very > large percentage of the irrupted birds are juveniles--this would tend to > suggest the irruption is in fact due to very successful clutch/hatchling > results. I realize that it's frustrating seeing these birds not doing > well, but keep in mind they are a species of Least Concern and have a > fairly stable population estimate of 300,000. > > A couple of additional things I'd like to comment on that have been > brought up. I would argue that being able to read a bird is not by using > 'human logic or behavior patterns', but rather animal behavior logic. > Animals in the wild simply do not turn their back on what they consider to > be a threat for prolonged periods of time. I think it also needs to be > brought up that these birds nest in the far north tundra and many of these > birds have never seen humans--they very well may not consider people as a > threat in the way that they would a wolf, arctic fox, eagle, etc. > > I also think that suggesting that people not look or observe them is on > the extreme side. As has been brought up here before (and elsewhere) Snowy > Owls are a bird that makes 'non-birders' stop and ask questions, and > genuinely enjoy the view. I showed several people at work (definitely > non-birders) the pictures I took from Milford Point and they were astounded > that such a creature even existed--and said they would love to see one. > Exposure and added interest to birding is only going to increase awareness > and support down the road. > > Two final question as I've seen this now brought up countless times--what > exactly does everyone consider to be 'too close' to a Snowy Owl? And why > the major restriction with getting 'close' to a Snowy Owl but it's > perfectly acceptable for a group of 20 people to be within 25 feet from a > Fork-tailed Flycatcher? > > _______________________________________________ > This list is provided by the Connecticut Ornithological Association (COA) > for the discussion of birds and birding in Connecticut. > For subscription information visit http://lists.ctbirding.org/ > mailman/listinfo/ctbirds_lists.ctbirding.org > -- Kevin R. Burgio @KRBurgio <https://twitter.com/KRBurgio> Ph.D. Student NSF Graduate Research Fellow University of Connecticut Ecology and Evolutionary Biology Dept kevin.burgio@uconn.edu (860) 486-3839 Monk Parakeet Research Website <http://www.eeb.uconn.edu/people/burgio> Facebook Parakeet Research Page<https://www.facebook.com/ConnecticutMonkParakeetResearch?ref=hl> Curriculum vitae<http://hydrodictyon.eeb.uconn.edu/eebedia/images/b/bb/Burgio_CV2.pdf>