In a message dated 10/21/2005 9:00:45 PM Pacific Standard Time, passagemaking-under-power-request@lists.samurai.com writes: Is a manual bilge pump a real requirement for a passagemaking vessel, or is it maybe another anachronism to be forgotten? I wanted to throw this question out to the list to possibly hear some varying opinions in order to make a more informed decision in my own circumstance. I'm finalizing my system design and purchasing equipment and questioning the redundancy of having the manual pump. My boat has three bulkheads; lazzerette, midships, and chain locker. The lazerrette, and forward of the midships bulkhead are hardpiped to the sump in the engine room, and with valves NO will drain freely there or can be valved to a 14k gph Pacer hydraulic pump. The chain locker similarly drains freely to the sump. The sump will also have a high capacity (2000 gph+) 12V submersible pump with its own discharge thruhull as the first line pump. There is also a small capacity 12V pump that is situated in its own container in the sump that is plumbed directly to the main and wing stuffing boxes (no dripless). The Pacer pump is also plumbed to the seachest and will double as the fire pump. The discharge for the pump is recessed into the side of the salon a few inches above the deck and is aimed at the freeing port opposite and terminates in a quick connect fitting. I'll keep a 25' flat pvc hose and nozzle and that will get to both ends of the boat. So I originally thought of using a manual pump like a Gulper, but now I'm questioning its usefullness. It would cost about $400, so it's not a deal breaker, but I think to be useful it would have to be accesible from above deck. Then is a question of where to place the deck plate. Any thoughts? Thanks for any input, John Crowley 46' steel trawler under construction I think your on the right track john that pump will be about as usfull as a pair of oars Brian Palmetto FL

Invader has two gusher pumps to pick up water from the first two compartments. they are plumbed up to the deck then to the flex hose that goes over the side. These pumps work OK at moving water but not real good at pumping it from my experience. So if you can keep the discharge close to the same level as the pick up they do OK, my experience. I run five 1500 auto rules set up two in each of the first compartments and one in the tunnel ( stuff box ). There is currently non in the tail. I use the same equipment and makes the spares easy to change out etc. I also run a high water alarm in the engine compartment. I have a jabasco with electric clutch off the main with raw water pick up and pick ups in both compartments. Discharge on deck for unloading the water. This is also available as a fire pump with hose and nozzle.. I carry in a locker on the back deck a GX Honda 4.5 fire pump portable along with a portable 120V sump pump. The only pump that gets use so far on Invader is the 1500 rule in the tunnel. The rest have not been needed on Invader. The portable pumps seem to have employment all the time. I recommend some kind of portable pump capable of moving some water. Over kill probably but why not. Willy Invader No 1 39 Kishi Conversion > In a message dated 10/21/2005 9:00:45 PM Pacific Standard Time, > passagemaking-under-power-request@lists.samurai.com writes: > Is a manual bilge pump a real requirement for a passagemaking vessel, or > is > it maybe another anachronism to be forgotten? > > I wanted to throw this question out to the list to possibly hear some > varying > opinions in order to make a more informed decision in my own circumstance. > > I'm finalizing my system design and purchasing equipment and questioning > the > redundancy of having the manual pump. My boat has three bulkheads; > lazzerette, midships, and chain locker. The lazerrette, and forward of > the midships > bulkhead are hardpiped to the sump in the engine room, and with valves NO > will > drain freely there or can be valved to a 14k gph Pacer hydraulic pump. > The > chain locker similarly drains freely to the sump. The sump will also have > a high > capacity (2000 gph+) 12V submersible pump with its own discharge thruhull > as > the first line pump. There is also a small capacity 12V pump that is > situated > in its own container in the sump that is plumbed directly to the main and > wing > stuffing boxes (no dripless). > The Pacer pump is also plumbed to the seachest and will double as the fire > pump. The discharge for the pump is recessed into the side of the salon a > few > inches above the deck and is aimed at the freeing port opposite and > terminates > in a quick connect fitting. I'll keep a 25' flat pvc hose and nozzle and > that > will get to both ends of the boat. > So I originally thought of using a manual pump like a Gulper, but now I'm > questioning its usefullness. It would cost about $400, so it's not a deal > breaker, but I think to be useful it would have to be accesible from above > deck. > Then is a question of where to place the deck plate. Any thoughts? > > Thanks for any input, > > John Crowley > > 46' steel trawler > under construction >