Empathy List Archives

KJ

Kratz, John M.

Tue, Jan 31, 2012 1:43 PM

I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about 500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM. Had mechanic on board who adjusted slightly and now down to a fine spray. Shaft running true. He suggested perhaps the shaft tube is blocked resulting in increase in water pressure as RPMs come up and water pressure from engine increases. Any ideas? Have you guys seen this before? Can a diver improve situation by scraping where shaft comes out of hull?

MH

Matthew Hahn

Tue, Jan 31, 2012 2:51 PM

How long have you run the vessel since it was tightned up. These require a
break-in period where they will "mist" until the carbon disc is polished and
truly seals. I have not heard of a tube clogging before. Have you had
your engine alignment checked recently?

-Matt
M/V Distinctively Lost

How long have you run the vessel since it was tightned up. These require a break-in period where they will "mist" until the carbon disc is polished and truly seals. I have not heard of a tube clogging before. Have you had your engine alignment checked recently? -Matt M/V Distinctively Lost

JP

Joseph Pica

Wed, Feb 1, 2012 2:58 AM

Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about
500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the
bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...."

If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless
steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated.

If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and
often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the
carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can
contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a
clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success
in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while
still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need
to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with
progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install
a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines
bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out?

Cheers,

Joe

M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37

MTOA# 3813

AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper)

CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com

Joseph.pica@gmail.com

Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about 500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...." If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated. If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out? Cheers, Joe M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 MTOA# 3813 AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com Joseph.pica@gmail.com

MA

MY ALLEZ

Wed, Feb 1, 2012 10:25 AM

Joe Pica makes good comments. My PYA seals are working flawlessly. I had compressed them I think 1/8"
more than installation recommended I never did get the misting on break in. No carbon dust on break in
and bone dry. You may have some kind of debri between the Carbon face and the Stainless steel rotor.

AGain I am running mine DRY with a Vent Line on my Lehman instead of Water Injection. Owner at PYI
said I could go either way in my installation, so I selected DRY. got enough water without worrkng about picking up junk in a water injection line and put addional T;s off the Heat Exchanger water line going to the exhaust elbow. If the water injection line gets clogged up, now you have another problem.

Bob
Onboard ALLEZ! Lying Marathon, FL

Capt Bob Kovach
M/Y ALLEZ! MT50 WB
MTOA 2631 AGLCA 1969
USPS CHARLESTON S.C.
EMail: my_allez@yahoo.com

From: Joseph Pica joseph.pica@gmail.com
To: "'Kratz, John M.'" kratzj@musc.edu; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:58 PM
Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal

Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about
500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the
bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...."

If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless
steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated.

If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and
often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the
carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can
contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a
clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success
in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while
still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need
to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with
progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install
a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines
bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out?

Cheers,

Joe

M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37

MTOA# 3813

AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper)

CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com

Joseph.pica@gmail.com

http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address,
unsubscribe, etc.) go to: http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

Joe Pica makes good comments. My PYA seals are working flawlessly. I had compressed them I think 1/8" more than installation recommended I never did get the misting on break in. No carbon dust on break in and bone dry. You may have some kind of debri between the Carbon face and the Stainless steel rotor. AGain I am running mine DRY with a Vent Line on my Lehman instead of Water Injection. Owner at PYI said I could go either way in my installation, so I selected DRY. got enough water without worrkng about picking up junk in a water injection line and put addional T;s off the Heat Exchanger water line going to the exhaust elbow. If the water injection line gets clogged up, now you have another problem. Bob Onboard ALLEZ! Lying Marathon, FL Capt Bob Kovach M/Y ALLEZ! MT50 WB MTOA 2631 AGLCA 1969 USPS CHARLESTON S.C. EMail: my_allez@yahoo.com ________________________________ From: Joseph Pica <joseph.pica@gmail.com> To: "'Kratz, John M.'" <kratzj@musc.edu>; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:58 PM Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about 500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...." If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated. If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out? Cheers, Joe M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 MTOA# 3813 AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com Joseph.pica@gmail.com _______________________________________________ http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) go to: http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

RY

Ralph Yost

Wed, Feb 1, 2012 11:30 AM

Running the PSS dry on a trawler is perfectly fine. HOWEVER if you ever haul
the boat, you need to BURP IT to allow water up into the bellows. An air
pocket can form after the water drains when you haul out. So once in the
water you need to pull the bellows back until it leaks, then release and let
it seal again.
If you have the water feed, this procedure is not necessary.

If you dont do this you can burn it up.
R.

-----Original Message-----
From: great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com
[mailto:great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com] On Behalf Of MY ALLEZ
Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2012 5:25 AM
To: Joseph Pica; 'Kratz, John M.'; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com
Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal ALLEZ Repl;y

Joe Pica makes good comments. My PYA seals are working flawlessly. I had
compressed them I think 1/8"
more than installation recommended I never did get the misting on break in.
No carbon dust on break in and bone dry. You may have some kind of debri
between the Carbon face and the Stainless steel rotor.

AGain I am running mine DRY with a Vent Line on my Lehman instead of Water
Injection. Owner at PYI said I could go either way in my installation, so I
selected DRY. got enough water without worrkng about picking up junk in a
water injection line and put addional T;s off the Heat Exchanger water line
going to the exhaust elbow. If the water injection line gets clogged up, now
you have another problem.

Bob
Onboard ALLEZ! Lying Marathon, FL

Capt Bob Kovach
M/Y ALLEZ! MT50 WB
MTOA 2631 AGLCA 1969
USPS CHARLESTON S.C.
EMail: my_allez@yahoo.com

From: Joseph Pica joseph.pica@gmail.com
To: "'Kratz, John M.'" kratzj@musc.edu; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com
Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:58 PM
Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal

Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about
500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the
bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...."

If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless
steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated.

If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and
often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the
carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can
contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a
clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success
in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while
still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need
to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with
progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install
a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines
bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out?

Cheers,

Joe

M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37

MTOA# 3813

AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper)

CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com

Joseph.pica@gmail.com

http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address,
unsubscribe, etc.) go to:
http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address,
unsubscribe, etc.) go to:
http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

Running the PSS dry on a trawler is perfectly fine. HOWEVER if you ever haul the boat, you need to BURP IT to allow water up into the bellows. An air pocket can form after the water drains when you haul out. So once in the water you need to pull the bellows back until it leaks, then release and let it seal again. If you have the water feed, this procedure is not necessary. If you dont do this you can burn it up. R. -----Original Message----- From: great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com [mailto:great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com] On Behalf Of MY ALLEZ Sent: Wednesday, February 01, 2012 5:25 AM To: Joseph Pica; 'Kratz, John M.'; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal ALLEZ Repl;y Joe Pica makes good comments. My PYA seals are working flawlessly. I had compressed them I think 1/8" more than installation recommended I never did get the misting on break in. No carbon dust on break in and bone dry. You may have some kind of debri between the Carbon face and the Stainless steel rotor. AGain I am running mine DRY with a Vent Line on my Lehman instead of Water Injection. Owner at PYI said I could go either way in my installation, so I selected DRY. got enough water without worrkng about picking up junk in a water injection line and put addional T;s off the Heat Exchanger water line going to the exhaust elbow. If the water injection line gets clogged up, now you have another problem. Bob Onboard ALLEZ! Lying Marathon, FL Capt Bob Kovach M/Y ALLEZ! MT50 WB MTOA 2631 AGLCA 1969 USPS CHARLESTON S.C. EMail: my_allez@yahoo.com ________________________________ From: Joseph Pica <joseph.pica@gmail.com> To: "'Kratz, John M.'" <kratzj@musc.edu>; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com Sent: Tuesday, January 31, 2012 9:58 PM Subject: Re: GL: PSS dripless shaft seal Snip:"...I have a leaking PSS dripless shaft seal, 49 Defever, 2006, about 500 hours on engine. Leaks around the where the large metal ring meets the bellows. Does not leak until engine reaches 1800 RPM...." If yours are face seals (a carbon fixed face mated to a rotating stainless steel disk locked on the shaft) it is very probably scarred or contaminated. If you churned up sand etc on a grounding or near grounding the sand can and often does marred the surface of the stainless steel disk (softer than the carbon face). Also, foreign material (grasses, critters, whatever) can contaminate/cake on (adhere to) the stainless steel disk face preventing a clean drip less seal between the faces. Some have had very limited success in trying to polish (clean the SS disk face with a fine grit emery) while still in place with the boat in the water. However, to do it right you need to pull the seal off (boat hauled) and polish the SS disk face with progressively fine grits. By the time you do this you might as well install a new set then keep the polished used set as an emergency back. Engines bouncing around can also cause misting but you've ruled that out? Cheers, Joe M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 MTOA# 3813 AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) CarolynAnn-N37.blogspot.com Joseph.pica@gmail.com _______________________________________________ http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) go to: http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com _______________________________________________ http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address, unsubscribe, etc.) go to: http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com