TWL: Survey pages and photos
I take a different position than many on both the survey and the "negligent Captain". First, having bought and sold boats over the years, I have never seen more than a half dozen or so pages, which was fully sufficient to ascertain the condition and seaworthiness. I never got any pictures, since I did not expect any, perhaps because I had crawled around to really take a look myself. In the two more recent surveys, on 30-40 ft vessels and both done by different, highly recommended and experienced surveyors, this was the case. The survey is supposed to provide you with an objective and comprehensive appraisal of the condition and value. In addition the survey should detail safety issues that need to be brought up to standard, IE, hose clamps, non working through hulls etc. The survey is what you end up with in hand, not what you heard or thought you heard. The details posted of this survey seem to indicate that it indeed indicated condition to include the substantial need for
repair or replacement. It then becomes the buyers obligation to make a decision. Fish or cut bait!
As to the deficiencies of the Captains skill or ability, or the owners neglect, it is irrelevant, the boat is what it is.
Our litigious society somehow conditions even the independent and self reliant cruiser into not accepting responsibility. It is now the buyers responsibility in my opinion.
I have just had a survey done on a 2004 demo boat.
The written part of the survey was 13 pages plus about 20 pictures.
Three pages defined the qualifications of the Surveyor, who the buyer is,
and specifications of the boat.
Digital cameras make pictures easy and well worth the effort in avoiding
confusion in trying to adaquately describe an "issue" with the boat.
It documents all "issues" in both text and by photo. The document made it
very clear what was needed to be done on the boat. The work was performed
both in and out of the water and included a sea trial.
The work was performed by Long Island Marine Surveyor and was quite
satisfactory to me.
Regards,
Bob Davis
And I have to disagree. As they say on "Law and Order" - goes to pattern. If
the captain did x,y, and z incorrectly; the prospective buyer then has to
have doubts about every maintenance issue on the boat. For example, did he
replace wiring at the owner's expense? If he did, I'd wonder if he used
tinned wire, performed a good crimp, provided strain-relief where necessary,
and used the appropriate connector.
Yes, it is Jim's job to make the decision, but he needs as much information
as possible before he "cuts bait." What he doesn't do is make a precipitous
decision based upon emotion.
At this point the boat is what it appears to be. The goal is to establish
the true condition of the boat based on the buyer's best efforts. It is only
"is what it is" in an "as is" sale. Jim's offer needs to be reduced by the
cost of the remedies based upon real-world estimates.
The problems that have been discussed can be corrected with money. Today, we
learn that the engine has "sagged" on it's mounts. The engine surveyor
should address this concern. Are they the right mounts and/or is it the
stringers which have failed (unlikely or the other LRC owners on the list
would have heard of such failures)?
Lastly, on my Tartan 27, Crealock 37, and Dyer 29; the surveys were much
longer and without pictures. The insurance surveys were shorter. However,
both on the Crealock and the Dyer, important deficiencies were missed and
some details were flat out wrong.
To some extent, used things are a gamble. The buyer's job is to lower the
odds.
Ron Rogers
----- Original Message -----
From: "Douglas Palmquist" palmwhit@sbcglobal.net
| I take a different position than many on both the survey and the
"negligent Captain".
| It then becomes the buyers obligation to make a decision. Fish or cut
bait!
| As to the deficiencies of the Captains skill or ability, or the owners
neglect, it is irrelevant, the boat is what it is.