Hi Jeff: Very sorry about the bad news. A blow like that can ruin your future boating forever. But for those wondering how to prevent this happening to you, here's my two cents worth. Boat surveyors are NOT diesel mechanics. There should always be two surveys (at least). One by the marine surveyor for the boat, and another by a highly qualified (on your particular engines) marine diesel mechanic. The selling broker will usually recommend both of these people. Stop and think about the broker's primary goal to sell the boat versus your goal to obtain a realistic survey. If the broker doesn't like a certain surveyor or mechanic, that might be a good sign to choose the unpopular surveyor. Always ask around for alternative surveyor recommendations. You are under no obligation to accept any of the broker's recommendations. Have the survey performed with the selling broker OFF of the boat and not hovering over the surveyor to offset any bad news. Have him take you to lunch. You, the potential buyer, are in complete charge of any survey. You are paying for this yourself and you can have it your way with your own chosen people. If the boat surveyor starts one of those "well I can't really check this because" routines, ask how much additional to really check that. If you're concerned, pay the man to do it right. If you get ambiguous information, get a second surveyor's opinion. In any case tell the surveyors that you want the survey kept confidential to you alone. Part of the deal. No pre-release to the broker. You may also want to pay a little more to meet privately with the surveyor after the survey is complete and get some subjective opinions including the surveyor's recommendations as to the best yard to correct deficiencies. Ask the engine surveyor to price out an estimate to correct problems. If the broker objects to this intense scrutiny, pass on the boat. Good marine insurance companies are good sources of unbiased boat surveyors. Authorized diesel engine dealers are good sources of engine surveyors. Mechanics who have gone through the factory courses are usually savvy to the particular engine involved. My big tip is - Pay the mechanic a little more to do just a little more on the engine survey. Take him aside and tell him you want him to take extra time and do it right and that you want ANY bad news straight out. An additional $300.00 for an engine survey on a potential of $35,000.00 rebuild seems like a good investment. Joe & Debbie Engel Marine Computer Services & JRE Computer Consulting, Inc. MV Freda Fly - 1973 40' Tollycraft Tri-cabin Portland, OR -----Original Message----- From: Jeff East [mailto:jeffe@MICROSOFT.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 1999 9:34 AM To: trawler-world-list@samurai.com Subject: TWL: Engine rebuild We bought the Sand Dollar (1989 53' Fleming pilothouse motoryacht, 2 CAT 3208NAs) in January of 1999. Before we bought her, we had a reputable marine surveyor go over the boat and engines and we sea trialed her. What I considered to be two minor anomalies showed up: the engines smoked a lot, and one ran slightly hotter than the other. The surveyor assured me the smoking is normal for 3208s, and didn't think the temperature differential was interesting. <SNIP>