The weapons carry permit class I recently attended recommends pepper spray. They sold aerosols that look like lipsticks and contain 30% concentration of capsaicin (sp?) pepper that are VERY disabling and LEGAL! * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** D C "Mac" Macdonald ** * Grand Lake & OKC - OK * ** AGLCA (#217) & USPS ** * * (no current boat) * * ** USAF & FAA, Retired ** ** Amateur Radio K2GKK ** * * k2gkk@hotmail.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > From: bob@saleshelp.com > To: joseph.pica@gmail.com; rocheconst@aol.com; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com > Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:10:36 -0500 > Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety > > I missed a lot of the thread but thought I'd contribute some things we did > on the loop. > > First, have three very pistols onboard with plenty of flares. The bright > orange ones are easily seen and work best. Keep one at each helm station and > one in the master cabin. They are Coast Guard approved and act as the > required flare launchers. We carried three with thirty rounds of flares, 10 > each. > > Just be damned careful if you fire one inside as it will burn through the > boat bulkheads (walls) and fiberglass hull in no time. Make sure you only > pull the trigger when the gun is aimed away from your boat (just as you > would any firearm). They will blow through a body so be aware what's on the > other side when it comes out still burning. There are no "redo's" if you > screw this one up. Make sure the first mate can reload while you fire. Or > you can reload when shaking violently with a sore as hell wrist from firing. > The plastic ones we fired when I was in the Coast Guard lasted about 30 > rounds before breaking after rapid fire exercise. They're probably better > today. There is probably some rule against firing them into the water as we > did (back in the day). But they sound like the 12 gauge shotgun round that > they are. Once they hit the water they will continue to burn until they > expend themselves. After just three to five firings, you'll be well > prepared. Many Coast Guard stations around the country that you'll pass can > make arrangements for you to get some experience. You can get them with a > .38 round cartridge insert. Don't. > > Second. Get your standard issue rubber welcome mat and put the tacks in from > the bottom up. They cannot be seen or felt until you step on the mat. Put > one at each entrance when you close up for the night. Great way to greet > unexpected guests and give you plenty of early warning and DNA samples. > > Third, the best deterrent to an approaching vessel is to whip out your smart > phone and start taking pictures and emailing them to a designated contact. > We took "pictures" of one boat that approached us on the river. Made a show > of sending the photos (oops didn't have a smart phone) when they got close > enough and off they went. > > Fourth, we used a "capt'n hook" knife on the end of a short boat hook for > our in stateroom protection of our second to the last resort. > > Fifth, keep your fire extinguisher within arm's length. If it's too late for > any of the other ideas, pull it under the covers with you and discharge > directly into the face. Then hit 'em with it. > > Sixth, think through your offensive and defensive moves before you have to > make them. Do a couple rehearsals. Have your first mate play "Kato" (you > remember, Peter Sellers in the Pink Panther series). Do this from the most > probable options and most probable locations where you will find yourself > and mate. > > Seventh, don't hit happy hour with unlimiteddddddd docktails. Suchch, that > you slurrrrr your wordths and have to be pourrrred into beddd in any > location where there might be uninvited guests coming callinggggg. You need > to have your wits about you. > > Hope this adds to your list of things you can do with things you've got on > board or can get at the local hardware store that are all legal and some > even required (fire extinguishers, very pistols). LOL > > Best, > Bob > > Bob DeGroot, M.Ed., DCH > Sales Training International > (281) 367-5599 (800) 551-7355 (713) 876-8787 (Cell) > www.SalesHelp.com > www.BobDeGroot.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: Great-Loop [mailto:great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com] On Behalf > Of Joseph Pica > Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 2:07 PM > To: rocheconst@aol.com; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com > Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety > > > Comments will be appreciated...." Snip:"...My wife and I are going to begin > our first Great Loop trip on or about the 1st of April - this year. I would > like to carry a hand gun for our personal protection. ..."You can not carry > a handgun into Canada...period! A declared "sporting gun" e.g. regular > shotgun or rifle when game in season or to a clay or rifle match yes but > there are hoops to jump through...but absolutely no handguns. > > Joe > > M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 > MTOA# 3813 > AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) > http://carolynann-n37.blogspot.com/ > Joseph.pica@gmail.com

I just remembered another perfect option to ward off trouble. Wasp spray. It shoots 30 feet and will temporarily blind the offender. It won't melt the fiberglass either! Cheap too. Elaine

Illegal in some states to use against humans. * * * * * * * * * * * * * ** D C "Mac" Macdonald ** * Grand Lake & OKC - OK * ** AGLCA (#217) & USPS ** * * (no current boat) * * ** USAF & FAA, Retired ** ** Amateur Radio K2GKK ** * * Since 30 Nov 1953 * * * * k2gkk@hotmail.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > From: elreib@comcast.net > Date: Thu, 14 Mar 2013 00:00:46 -0400 > To: great-loop@lists.trawlering.com > Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety > > I just remembered another perfect option to ward off trouble. Wasp spray. It shoots 30 feet and will temporarily blind the offender. It won't melt the fiberglass either! Cheap too. > > Elaine

Not, repeat not legal in Canada. Nor is mace. Ted ----- Original Message ----- From: "D C _Mac_ Macdonald" <k2gkk@hotmail.com> To: <bob@saleshelp.com>; "Great Loop List" <great-loop@lists.trawlering.com> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 9:24 PM Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety > > The weapons carry permit class I recently attended recommends > pepper spray. They sold aerosols that look like lipsticks and > contain 30% concentration of capsaicin (sp?) pepper that are > VERY disabling and LEGAL! > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * > ** D C "Mac" Macdonald ** > * Grand Lake & OKC - OK * > ** AGLCA (#217) & USPS ** > * * (no current boat) * * > ** USAF & FAA, Retired ** > ** Amateur Radio K2GKK ** > * * k2gkk@hotmail.com * * > * * * * * * * * * * * * * > > > >> From: bob@saleshelp.com >> To: joseph.pica@gmail.com; rocheconst@aol.com; >> great-loop@lists.trawlering.com >> Date: Wed, 13 Mar 2013 20:10:36 -0500 >> Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety >> >> I missed a lot of the thread but thought I'd contribute some things we >> did >> on the loop. >> >> First, have three very pistols onboard with plenty of flares. The bright >> orange ones are easily seen and work best. Keep one at each helm station >> and >> one in the master cabin. They are Coast Guard approved and act as the >> required flare launchers. We carried three with thirty rounds of flares, >> 10 >> each. >> >> Just be damned careful if you fire one inside as it will burn through the >> boat bulkheads (walls) and fiberglass hull in no time. Make sure you only >> pull the trigger when the gun is aimed away from your boat (just as you >> would any firearm). They will blow through a body so be aware what's on >> the >> other side when it comes out still burning. There are no "redo's" if you >> screw this one up. Make sure the first mate can reload while you fire. Or >> you can reload when shaking violently with a sore as hell wrist from >> firing. >> The plastic ones we fired when I was in the Coast Guard lasted about 30 >> rounds before breaking after rapid fire exercise. They're probably better >> today. There is probably some rule against firing them into the water as >> we >> did (back in the day). But they sound like the 12 gauge shotgun round >> that >> they are. Once they hit the water they will continue to burn until they >> expend themselves. After just three to five firings, you'll be well >> prepared. Many Coast Guard stations around the country that you'll pass >> can >> make arrangements for you to get some experience. You can get them with a >> .38 round cartridge insert. Don't. >> >> Second. Get your standard issue rubber welcome mat and put the tacks in >> from >> the bottom up. They cannot be seen or felt until you step on the mat. Put >> one at each entrance when you close up for the night. Great way to greet >> unexpected guests and give you plenty of early warning and DNA samples. >> >> Third, the best deterrent to an approaching vessel is to whip out your >> smart >> phone and start taking pictures and emailing them to a designated >> contact. >> We took "pictures" of one boat that approached us on the river. Made a >> show >> of sending the photos (oops didn't have a smart phone) when they got >> close >> enough and off they went. >> >> Fourth, we used a "capt'n hook" knife on the end of a short boat hook for >> our in stateroom protection of our second to the last resort. >> >> Fifth, keep your fire extinguisher within arm's length. If it's too late >> for >> any of the other ideas, pull it under the covers with you and discharge >> directly into the face. Then hit 'em with it. >> >> Sixth, think through your offensive and defensive moves before you have >> to >> make them. Do a couple rehearsals. Have your first mate play "Kato" (you >> remember, Peter Sellers in the Pink Panther series). Do this from the >> most >> probable options and most probable locations where you will find yourself >> and mate. >> >> Seventh, don't hit happy hour with unlimiteddddddd docktails. Suchch, >> that >> you slurrrrr your wordths and have to be pourrrred into beddd in any >> location where there might be uninvited guests coming callinggggg. You >> need >> to have your wits about you. >> >> Hope this adds to your list of things you can do with things you've got >> on >> board or can get at the local hardware store that are all legal and some >> even required (fire extinguishers, very pistols). LOL >> >> Best, >> Bob >> >> Bob DeGroot, M.Ed., DCH >> Sales Training International >> (281) 367-5599 (800) 551-7355 (713) 876-8787 (Cell) >> www.SalesHelp.com >> www.BobDeGroot.com >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Great-Loop [mailto:great-loop-bounces@lists.trawlering.com] On >> Behalf >> Of Joseph Pica >> Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 2:07 PM >> To: rocheconst@aol.com; great-loop@lists.trawlering.com >> Subject: Re: GL: Opinions on safety >> >> >> Comments will be appreciated...." Snip:"...My wife and I are going to >> begin >> our first Great Loop trip on or about the 1st of April - this year. I >> would >> like to carry a hand gun for our personal protection. ..."You can not >> carry >> a handgun into Canada...period! A declared "sporting gun" e.g. regular >> shotgun or rifle when game in season or to a clay or rifle match yes but >> there are hoops to jump through...but absolutely no handguns. >> >> Joe >> >> M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 >> MTOA# 3813 >> AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) >> http://carolynann-n37.blogspot.com/ >> Joseph.pica@gmail.com > > _______________________________________________ > http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/listinfo/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com > > To modify your Great-Loop subscription options (change email address, > unsubscribe, etc.) go to: > http://lists.trawlering.com/mailman/options/great-loop_lists.trawlering.com

We carry those pressurized horn cans both topside and in the saloon. Figure a blast from one of those in a perp's direction is going to cause severe disorientation for at least a short period of time. I like the wasp/hornet spray idea, also - a twofer! Will add a couple of cans to the inventory. <><><><><><><><><><><><>Mozilla Thunderbird<><><><><><><><><><> Bob McLeran and Judy Young Manatee Cove Marina MV Sanderling Patrick Air Force Base DeFever 41 Trawler Satellite Beach, Florida Blog: http://mvsanderling.net/Blog Web: http://cruising.mvsanderling.net/

REPLY: These are much better options than deadly force. Imagine shooting and killing some drunk who wandered onto your boat. Even IF, and that is a big IF --- even if you are cleared legally when all is said and done, imagine the trouble: likely court proceedings, maybe civil lawsuit, big time lawyer fees, being tied up in some distant place for a long time while the legal process runs its course etc., etc. David Sorenson Duluth, MN SNIP: (1) We carry those pressurized horn cans both topside and in the saloon. Figure a blast from one of those in a perp's direction is going to cause severe disorientation for at least a short period of time. (2) I like the wasp/hornet spray idea, also - a twofer! Will add a couple of cans to the inventory.

It would be interesting to compare crime stats of incidents on boats versus dirt living. Perhaps the AGLCA can begin a forum/survey of this topic for posting and collecting any incidents occurring to any looper. Of course only anecdotal but better data then the just pandering to a fear feeding frenzy. We have had only one incident in our 28,000 miles of inland cruising on both Great Loop routes, almost all the Western Rivers to include the entire Ohio, Monongahela, Great Kanawha, Tennessee, Lower Mississippi, Tenn Tom, Potomac, Cumberland(to Nashville) etc, etc,. The incident was a boarding in Rochester NY, at the upscale Corn Hill landing at 0230hrs a drunk college girl got on the boat to pose for pictures(Titanic style) on our bow pulpit by her male friends on the sidewalk. After seeing this old grouchy "sasquatch haired" half naked apparition appear, she scampered off the boat and ran away giggling (kind' a hurt my macho). No wasp spray etc needed. I have never felt the need to carry a gun or keep one on board. I prefer to accept that the risk of being harmed is very very small if common sense is used with regard to time a place. I would not recommend shooting anyone for a theft/attempt. I have insurance. As stated the civil ramifications are extensive even if justified "criminally" by "stand your ground", and Federal District Court trumps States when "civil Rights" violations are proffered to the Courts. Joe M/V "Carolyn Ann" GH N-37 MTOA# 3813 AGLCA# 5485 (Platinum Looper) http://carolynann-n37.blogspot.com/ Joseph.pica@gmail.com

Funny, Both times we have been boarded was at night, by a young Girl, who was prompted by her friends (or friend). And yes, they do move fast once they spot me. . . . We have installed two switches near the bunk, one for the deck lights and one for the wake-the-dead dual Buell air horn. So far Decklights and movement inside have worked.... -al- Viking Star 45' Monk Sr. / McQueen mvVikingStar.blogspot.com