Good for you, Sonaia! You tell it like it is! Guys: In case you are now aware, after taking their boat on its own bottom to Fort Lauderdale from California, Sonaia and her captain, Chris Samuelson, crossed the Atlantic eastbound in 2004 on the Nordhavn Atlantic Rally and have been cruising the Med in their N57 Goleen ever since. They are the real deal, and Sonaia knows of whence she speaks. I hope to follow in their wake this summer on Med Bound 2007 and rendezvous with them in the Med. My first mate (er, admiral) would agree with all the Sonaia has said here--and is looking forward to crossing the Atlantic this summer in her safe, comfy Nordhavn. As the organizer of Med Bound 2007, I sought diligently to find other makes of motor yachts to cross with us. Alas, it was not to be. Though it wasn't planned that way, we will be an all-Nordhavn rally: 10 Nordhavns, half going Lauderdale to Bermuda to Newport and the rest continuing on to the Azores and Gibraltar. Where, I wonder, are the other ocean-crossing passagemaking motoryachts? From what I can see, damned few of them are out there crossing oceans, but there are a lot of folks on the sidelines talking about the ABILITY of their boats to cross oceans. To be sure, there are non-Nordhavns crossing oceans, but when one looks at the numbers of yachts under 100 feet there are more Nordhavns doing it than all other brands combined. Bash Nordhavns all you like. When the time comes to cross an ocean in a "small" motoryacht, not many of us out there doing is would like to do so in anything else. --Milt Baker, Nordhavn 47 Bluewater Hi Guys, I opened my gmail today and I found over 30 emails back and forth about you guys discussing an array of different subjects and I thought like putting my nose in it too for a bit. This 'discussion' of yours about the Nordhavn's are fascinating to read. In one way or another, almost all of you have a good point about this subject: BOB: "So come on guys, lets encourage all folks who are interested in passagemaking, and not make this the "Nordhavn club". Absolutely! Lets give incentive to more people to get rid of their fears and anxieties and to be able to experience what we power/sail 'boaters' are experiencing. BUT, and that is a BIG BUT, hopping that THEY KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING when they do finally purchase a boat that may haven't been tried exhaustively by the company owners and some private owners and that can give you a testimony by EXPERIENCE that the boat is safe and seaworthy. Just to exemplify what I am talking about. We went to the Dusseldorf last boat show in Germany a couple of months ago and we visited the the most talked about boat of the show which was this 'thing' called 'Bandido', a motorboat 90 feet long with a lot of steel, built by Drettman. www.bandido-yachts.com The boat is big, expensive as hell ( I stick to my Nordhavn 57 at any day of the year!) full of non sense stuff including the shock of my life: THE GALLEY HAD A CERAMIC STOVE TOP! I almost fell with horror to think that a boat that was supposed to be build to go to sea ( as they claim) has a ceramic, shinning and impossibly slippery top with no protection whats or ever around, could be aloud to be fitted! Are they kidding? Have this people EVER been at sea before and tried to cook at least once? And this is only one aspect of a very big boat with many complex systems to go wrong in the wrong places of the 'seven seas' as they put it. YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN? I guess Peter does. ALAN: "It does, although the "get the next best and bigger model"is hardly unique -- Nordhavn has certainly done a wonderful job in its implementation. The reference to "hype" was to ability of companies to market their next or "better" or "bigger" model to produce sales. YES, they are good on that but Alan, PAE does't ONLY do good publicity and feed the 'hype', to get sales sailing, they get their hands dirty and they experience themselves what they preach with success and that is something to REALLY consider here. Also, everytime we needed them in the middle of nowhere or in a busy city, they where there for us. They ALWAYS picked up their phones and gave us support an that is important too and only who have been out there and needed this kind of customer service will understand what I am saying. So, when one buys a Nordhavn, one is not only buing a good and seawothy boat, one is bying a very important package that cames with it too. (again, my humble opinion, though) PETER: "On the issue of hype that you mention you have got this completely wrong in my view. This implies that people purchase Nordhavn's on hype rather than experience, hard cold research, and perspicacity. The profile I have of a typical Nordhavn owner is someone who has an engineering/quality type background. Commercial airline pilots certainly stands out as one major background." In opinion you are SPOT ON Peter! My captain and partner in life Chris Samuelson who is not only is a VERY SMART GUY but was one of the biggest boat builder in England in the 80's and has been sailing since the was 4 years old and is a very successful business man, has spent a long time on researching many different boats before he chose our Nordhavan 57 almost 4 years ago. After a lot of consideration, he decided to put his faith in PAE and the Nordhavn's sea worthiness and told me that he wouldn't go out to sea with anything else (his personal opinion, of course). To be honest, I haven't been at sea with 'anything else' but I am really happy to stick with our Goleen, though. When I started cruising I didn't know anything about boating AT ALL. The two of us did a lot of trips on our own on manacing waters and I must say that it was a very steep learn curve INDEED for me but one thing that I NEVER felt was that I was unsafe, that the boat wouldn't take it. She looked after us every time we needed her to look after us. Cracking boat! When you guys talk about this and that regarding the cruising world and experiences, you talk from a 'male' perspective which is a whole different ball game from us 'girls'. It is a lot about technicalities, bits and bolts, spare parts and engines... a bit tougher and braver world, even if it is sometimes only to look and feel good. Us 'girls' see the cruising world and life in a different light and being anxious about a passage is a recipe for seasickness and many other abhorrent feelings. The bottom line is that feeling/being safe is PARAMOUNT and I do HOPE that all of you guys and girls out there that are about to buy a new boat, Nordhavn or not, do your research well and make sure that the beauty and the sea worthiness of your new purchase is not left behind in 'terra firma' on those glossy brochures/magazines when you go for a long passage or Ocean crossing. All the best to you all. Sonaia Hermida Goleen's Nordhan 5729 first mate, admiral and everything in between

You know, I was starting to get very excited about this discussion. Someone made what I thought was such a great point vis-a-vis making a logical plan to prepare for hazards one is likely to encounter when either offshore, or perhaps on an extended coastal cruise well outside the U.S. I mean, what a constructive approach! While the data has not necessarily been analyzed formally, we DO have people like Mike Maurice and Bob Austin and others contributing, who have seen personally, and/or have heard from numerous other passagemakers power and sail over many years, the upshot of which could answer some important questions for us and start some very meaningful discussion in that direction... For example: what are the 3 things MOST likely to seriously ruin one's passage, or extended/foreign coastal cruise, in order of likelihood? Is it pirates?? Apparently not. Is it lightning? I don't know, but probably not that, either. These may be the most disastrous imaginable events should they occur, invoking fear in our hearts, but that doesn't mean they are the ones that warrant the bulk of our thoughtful preparation ahead of time. I'd love to hear from those who have 'earned the right to speak' on this, and you know who you are... rank the top 3 by your informal analysis of events over the years, irrespective of what makes the most dramatic story. Then we might launch into a really useful thread on things like collision avoidance, or perhaps (boring but critical) fuel issues, or health- related emergencies, or whatever. Hear about different experiences, perhaps some creative solutions. Really get somewhere! But then I read stuff like this: On Mar 23, 2007, at 7:15 PM: > Where, I wonder, are the other ocean-crossing passagemaking > motoryachts? From what I can see, damned few of them are out there > crossing oceans, but there are a lot of folks on the sidelines > talking about the ABILITY of their boats to cross oceans. To be > sure, there are non-Nordhavns crossing oceans, but when one looks > at the numbers of yachts under 100 feet there are more Nordhavns > doing it than all other brands combined. > > Bash Nordhavns all you like. When the time comes to cross an ocean > in a "small" motoryacht, not many of us out there doing is would > like to do so in anything else. And it's disheartening. The majority of us probably did not join this list-serve in order to figure out whose dad can beat up the other guy's dad. Can't we instead make use of this brilliant medium, where we can put collective experience and lots of keen minds in the same place... identify some truly key issues and sink some teeth into them? And while one could argue that the choice of vessel qualifies as a 'truly key issue' in this context, I'd venture to guess that for most of us on the list, that decision is water under the bridge. So why not leave that be and move on to more interesting questions? Valerie Creighton No Nordhavn No Captain's License ... and come to think of it, questionable parentage

Hey Milt, Some people here on this forum seem to think that talking about technicalities ALONE when crossing an ocean will save the day. Be aware you lot, LIFE is going to bite you in the arse, sooner or later! Looking forward to meeting you again on your new shinny Nordy! All the best to the ADMIRAL. ( smart lady too!) Sonaia Hermida :-) On 3/24/07, Milt Baker <miltbaker@mindspring.com> wrote: > > Good for you, Sonaia! You tell it like it is! > > Guys: In case you are now aware, after taking their boat on its own > bottom to Fort Lauderdale from California, Sonaia and her captain, Chris > Samuelson, crossed the Atlantic eastbound in 2004 on the Nordhavn Atlantic > Rally and have been cruising the Med in their N57 Goleen ever since. They > are the real deal, and Sonaia knows of whence she speaks. I hope to follow > in their wake this summer on Med Bound 2007 and rendezvous with them in the > Med. My first mate (er, admiral) would agree with all the Sonaia has said > here--and is looking forward to crossing the Atlantic this summer in her > safe, comfy Nordhavn. > > As the organizer of Med Bound 2007, I sought diligently to find other > makes of motor yachts to cross with us. Alas, it was not to be. Though it > wasn't planned that way, we will be an all-Nordhavn rally: 10 Nordhavns, > half going Lauderdale to Bermuda to Newport and the rest continuing on to > the Azores and Gibraltar. > > Where, I wonder, are the other ocean-crossing passagemaking > motoryachts? From what I can see, damned few of them are out there crossing > oceans, but there are a lot of folks on the sidelines talking about the > ABILITY of their boats to cross oceans. To be sure, there are non-Nordhavns > crossing oceans, but when one looks at the numbers of yachts under 100 feet > there are more Nordhavns doing it than all other brands combined. > > Bash Nordhavns all you like. When the time comes to cross an ocean in a > "small" motoryacht, not many of us out there doing is would like to do so in > anything else. > > --Milt Baker, Nordhavn 47 Bluewater > > > > > Hi Guys, > > I opened my gmail today and I found over 30 emails back and forth about > you > guys discussing an array of different subjects and I thought like putting > my > nose in it too for a bit. > This 'discussion' of yours about the Nordhavn's are fascinating to read. > In > one way or another, almost all of you have a good point about this > subject: > > BOB: "So come on guys, lets encourage all folks who are interested in > passagemaking, and not make this the "Nordhavn club". > > Absolutely! Lets give incentive to more people to get rid of their fears > and > anxieties and to be able to experience what we power/sail 'boaters' are > experiencing. BUT, and that is a BIG BUT, hopping that THEY KNOW WHAT > THEY > ARE DOING when they do finally purchase a boat that may haven't been tried > exhaustively by the company owners and some private owners and that can > give > you a testimony by EXPERIENCE that the boat is safe and seaworthy. > > Just to exemplify what I am talking about. We went to the Dusseldorf last > boat show in Germany a couple of months ago and we visited the the most > talked about boat of the show which was this 'thing' called 'Bandido', a > motorboat 90 feet long with a lot of steel, built by Drettman. > www.bandido-yachts.com > The boat is big, expensive as hell ( I stick to my Nordhavn 57 at any day > of > the year!) full of non sense stuff including the shock of my life: THE > GALLEY HAD A CERAMIC STOVE TOP! I almost fell with horror to think that a > boat that was supposed to be build to go to sea ( as they claim) has a > ceramic, shinning and impossibly slippery top with no protection whats or > ever around, could be aloud to be fitted! > Are they kidding? Have this people EVER been at sea before and tried to > cook > at least once? And this is only one aspect of a very big boat with many > complex systems to go wrong in the wrong places of the 'seven seas' as > they > put it. > YOU SEE WHAT I MEAN? I guess Peter does. > > ALAN: "It does, although the "get the next best and bigger model"is hardly > unique -- Nordhavn has certainly done a wonderful job in its > implementation. The reference to "hype" was to ability of companies to > market their next or "better" or "bigger" model to produce sales. > > YES, they are good on that but Alan, PAE does't ONLY do good publicity and > feed the 'hype', to get sales sailing, they get their hands dirty and they > experience themselves what they preach with success and that is something > to > REALLY consider here. Also, everytime we needed them in the middle of > nowhere or in a busy city, they where there for us. They ALWAYS picked up > their phones and gave us support an that is important too and only who > have > been out there and needed this kind of customer service will understand > what > I am saying. So, when one buys a Nordhavn, one is not only buing a good > and > seawothy boat, one is bying a very important package that cames with it > too. > (again, my humble opinion, though) > > PETER: "On the issue of hype that you mention you have got this completely > wrong in my view. This implies that people purchase Nordhavn's on hype > rather than experience, hard cold research, and perspicacity. The profile > I > have of a typical Nordhavn owner is someone who has an engineering/quality > type background. Commercial airline pilots certainly stands out as one > major > background." > > In opinion you are SPOT ON Peter! > > My captain and partner in life Chris Samuelson who is not only is a VERY > SMART GUY but was one of the biggest boat builder in England in the 80's > and has been sailing since the was 4 years old and is a very successful > business man, has spent a long time on researching many different > boats before he chose our Nordhavan 57 almost 4 years ago. After a lot of > consideration, he decided to put his faith in PAE and the Nordhavn's sea > worthiness and told me that he wouldn't go out to sea with anything else > (his personal opinion, of course). To be honest, I haven't been at sea > with > 'anything else' but I am really happy to stick with our Goleen, though. > > When I started cruising I didn't know anything about boating AT ALL. The > two > of us did a lot of trips on our own on manacing waters and I must say that > it was a very steep learn curve INDEED for me but one thing that I NEVER > felt was that I was unsafe, that the boat wouldn't take it. She looked > after > us every time we needed her to look after us. Cracking boat! > > When you guys talk about this and that regarding the cruising world and > experiences, you talk from a 'male' perspective which is a whole different > ball game from us 'girls'. It is a lot about technicalities, bits and > bolts, spare parts and engines... a bit tougher and braver world, even if > it > is sometimes only to look and feel good. > Us 'girls' see the cruising world and life in a different light and being > anxious about a passage is a recipe for seasickness and many other > abhorrent > feelings. > The bottom line is that feeling/being safe is PARAMOUNT and I do HOPE that > all of you guys and girls out there that are about to buy a new boat, > Nordhavn or not, do your research well and make sure that the beauty and > the > sea worthiness of your new purchase is not left behind in 'terra > firma' on > those glossy brochures/magazines when you go for a long passage or Ocean > crossing. > > All the best to you all. > > Sonaia Hermida > Goleen's Nordhan 5729 first mate, admiral and everything in between > _______________________________________________ > > Passagemaking Under Power and PUP are trademarks of Water World > Productions, formerly known as Trawler World Productions. > > To be removed from the PUP list send an email with the > subject "unsubscribe" (no quotes) to the link below: > > mailto:passagemaking-under-power-request@lists.samurai.com > > Passagemaking-Under-Power Mailing List

> For example: what are the 3 things MOST likely > to seriously ruin one's passage, or > extended/foreign coastal cruise, in order of > likelihood? Health emergency, Navigational error, fire, and running out of coffee (4 because 'running out of coffee' and 'health emergency' are almost synonomous). It's only a guess, but I'd say most commercial vessels place 'fire' at the top of their list. With so many flammable goodies aboard and ignition sources, its easy to see why. Peter (Willard 36, San Francisco)