Gamma-ray and jitter
In the very recent days it has been discovered a previously unknown
feature of our galaxy, that is the presence of two giant bubbles
which appear to be gamma-ray sources.
See
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/GLAST/news/new-structure.html
After reading this, I have revieved some old data of mine, which shoved
that the noise in a long term temperature measurement is higher when my
observing site is in view of that structure. Now I'm rather
convinced that there could be a correlation between my observations and
the above mentioned new findings, and I believe that the noise is
generated by the measuring setup in response to something
linked to the bubbles.
Hence I'm wondering if that stimulus could also affect the jitter in
high performance oscillators.
More precisely, I would ask time-nuts whether any sidereal periodicities
have ever been noticed in jitter measurements.
Thanks,
Antonio I8IOV
Hi
As always - eliminating environmental influence from the results can be challenging. Even with the parts in a vacuum chamber attached to a heated block, there can still be things that directly relate to the building going from day to night mode or from week day to week end mode.
That said - yes there are periodic influences. Everything I've seen appears to correlate to local time rather than sidereal time. I would admit that it could be a function of back fitting.
Bob
On Nov 13, 2010, at 5:48 PM, iovane@inwind.it wrote:
In the very recent days it has been discovered a previously unknown
feature of our galaxy, that is the presence of two giant bubbles
which appear to be gamma-ray sources.
See
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/GLAST/news/new-structure.html
After reading this, I have revieved some old data of mine, which shoved
that the noise in a long term temperature measurement is higher when my
observing site is in view of that structure. Now I'm rather
convinced that there could be a correlation between my observations and
the above mentioned new findings, and I believe that the noise is
generated by the measuring setup in response to something
linked to the bubbles.
Hence I'm wondering if that stimulus could also affect the jitter in
high performance oscillators.
More precisely, I would ask time-nuts whether any sidereal periodicities
have ever been noticed in jitter measurements.
Thanks,
Antonio I8IOV
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On 11/14/2010 12:43 AM, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
As always - eliminating environmental influence from the results can be challenging. Even with the parts in a vacuum chamber attached to a heated block, there can still be things that directly relate to the building going from day to night mode or from week day to week end mode.
That said - yes there are periodic influences. Everything I've seen appears to correlate to local time rather than sidereal time. I would admit that it could be a function of back fitting.
If the measurements where long-term enough such that local time rather
than sidereal time can be cancelled out and tied to the sidereal
direction part of the puzzle is solved. However, showing that it is this
gamma radiation effect in play and no other sidereal related effect is
one thing.
I'd like to see the correlation spanning over a year, a couple of years
would be best. That way could local time effects clearly be separated
from sidereal effects.
Jitter measurements is usually not done continously, but wander
measurements.
Don't recall from the top of my head the effects of gamma-rays on
crystals, but I do recall there is effects there. However, I do suspect
they are rather poor gamma-ray detectors and loads of other sources to
hide any correlation from direct observation.
Cheers,
Magnus
I am dubious of this but cant find a reference at the moment. Very little of
the massive doses of hard X-rays from the Sun actually reach the earths
surface. Most interact with the atmosphere to produce the ionisation layers.
Gamma have the same effect. If substantial Gammas were reaching the ground
evolution would be even more rapid :-))
see Wiki on cell damage from Gamma rays.
Alan G3NYK
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Camp" lists@rtty.us
To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement"
time-nuts@febo.com
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 11:43 PM
Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Gamma-ray and jitter
Hi
As always - eliminating environmental influence from the results can be
challenging. Even with the parts in a vacuum chamber attached to a heated
block, there can still be things that directly relate to the building going
from day to night mode or from week day to week end mode.
That said - yes there are periodic influences. Everything I've seen
appears to correlate to local time rather than sidereal time. I would admit
that it could be a function of back fitting.
Bob
On Nov 13, 2010, at 5:48 PM, iovane@inwind.it wrote:
In the very recent days it has been discovered a previously unknown
feature of our galaxy, that is the presence of two giant bubbles
which appear to be gamma-ray sources.
See
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/GLAST/news/new-structure.html
After reading this, I have revieved some old data of mine, which shoved
that the noise in a long term temperature measurement is higher when my
observing site is in view of that structure. Now I'm rather
convinced that there could be a correlation between my observations and
the above mentioned new findings, and I believe that the noise is
generated by the measuring setup in response to something
linked to the bubbles.
Hence I'm wondering if that stimulus could also affect the jitter in
high performance oscillators.
More precisely, I would ask time-nuts whether any sidereal periodicities
have ever been noticed in jitter measurements.
Thanks,
Antonio I8IOV
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
and follow the instructions there.
time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com
To unsubscribe, go to
and follow the instructions there.
Hi
Radiation sensitivity on swept quartz can be in the megarad region. For unswept quartz it's anybody's guess. Normal estimates are in the 10K rad range. It all depends on just what nasty impurities there are in the lattice.
Bob
On Nov 13, 2010, at 7:27 PM, Magnus Danielson wrote:
On 11/14/2010 12:43 AM, Bob Camp wrote:
Hi
As always - eliminating environmental influence from the results can be challenging. Even with the parts in a vacuum chamber attached to a heated block, there can still be things that directly relate to the building going from day to night mode or from week day to week end mode.
That said - yes there are periodic influences. Everything I've seen appears to correlate to local time rather than sidereal time. I would admit that it could be a function of back fitting.
If the measurements where long-term enough such that local time rather than sidereal time can be cancelled out and tied to the sidereal direction part of the puzzle is solved. However, showing that it is this gamma radiation effect in play and no other sidereal related effect is one thing.
I'd like to see the correlation spanning over a year, a couple of years would be best. That way could local time effects clearly be separated from sidereal effects.
Jitter measurements is usually not done continously, but wander measurements.
Don't recall from the top of my head the effects of gamma-rays on crystals, but I do recall there is effects there. However, I do suspect they are rather poor gamma-ray detectors and loads of other sources to hide any correlation from direct observation.
Cheers,
Magnus
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and follow the instructions there.
On Sun, 14 Nov 2010 01:27:10 +0100
Magnus Danielson magnus@rubidium.dyndns.org wrote:
Don't recall from the top of my head the effects of gamma-rays on
crystals, but I do recall there is effects there. However, I do
suspect they are rather poor gamma-ray detectors and loads of other
sources to hide any correlation from direct observation.
IIRC, Crystals usually are made up from silicon dioxide in a more or
less pure crystalline form. I usually deal with more or less amorphuous
silicon dioxide as in gate oxides, and i'm not sure whether or not this
makes a difference.
Anyways, gamma rays can produce electron-hole pairs in SiO2. And while
electrons are fairly mobile (at least compared to the holes), this can
depending on DC bias conditions lead to a net positive charge inside
the crystal. This charge could be annealed though by applying high
temperatures on the order of several hundred °C to the crystal.
No idea what some electric field could do jitter-wise though. Might
have to do with some sort of mechanical stress inside the crystal due
to electric forces.
I think there are more mechanisms, but here i'm not sure. Am just
learning about that stuff. But I would be willing to look it up at
work ;-)
HTH,
Florian