Re: [PUP] Re: Swimsteps
Hi, Bob,
My point was that folks who are "designing" their own boats should be careful
when discussing criteria which are outside the scope of their expertise. I
didn't mean to single out any one person. Perhaps "conceptualizing" would be a
better word. I know from experience that architects are very protective of
certain words being used by those outside the profession. For instance, whereas
"designing" may not be one, I know that "engineering" is.
However, I'll take issue with your statement, "On the other hand there are a
number of very accomplished yacht designers and boat builders who are not
naval architects nor who employ naval architects." I'll bet that designers who
are not NAs engage one before finalizing their designs. For one thing, to do
otherwise would incur a huge liability. For another, as a customer, I'd want that
stamp on the plans for my boat!
John
"Seahorse"
Bob Austin writes:
There are lots of very good boats designed and built by designers who are
not naval architects. Michael Kasten, and George Buhler are not naval
architects--so should we discard all of their designs and boats? Bill Lee is not a
naval architict, nor was George Olsen or Ron Moore--yet these people designed
and built some of the best boats of the last few decades.
The modifications to my Cal 46 were designed by a yacht designer. I would
put his boats up against any in the world for handling and seaworthyness. The
work was done by an Austrialian shipwright who spend 6 years in a college
and apprenticeship program--and is world class in his worksmanship.
I certainly would not advocate that anyone without experience or boating
knowlege design and build a boat.
If I was having a large boat built, I certainly would want it to be designed
and supervised by a naval architect. If I am not mistaken Mike is an
excellent engineer and fully capable of assessing what the design permaters are of
a boat his size. It is by asking questions and looking at other's designs
that we come to an "ideal" boat for each of us.
Hi John,
I cannot speak for all designers, but some that I know do not employ or consult with Naval Architects. The ones that I know have engineering degrees. There are also a group of people who have taken Westlawn's correspondance course and call themselves Naval Architects.
From the Westlawn's web site:
Q. Is a Westlawn graduate a yacht designer or a naval architect?
A. In many states you would be known as either. Some states have laws requiring that you have a Professional Engineering license to be called a naval architect. As Westlawn graduates usually are
Q. Does Westlawn grant a degree?
A. Westlawn grants a professional diploma to all graduates of the Yacht Design course. A certificate of completion is awarded to graduates of the Yacht Design Lite course. Degrees are not awarded, as the course concentration is specific to yacht design and does not include courses in the humanities, arts or general education.
So I ask what is a Naval Architect? I would be happy with a good engineer who is knowlegable in yacht design. Since I come from an academic background, I would expect an NA to be degreed from a major program. I would prefer a graduate, preferably with a master's degree from MIT, University of Michigan or perhaps Southampton Institute (from the other side of the pond). (There are certainly some other schools which are good, but I would rank these in the top)
I cannot speak to the liablity issues, but in the past--and still in some areas boats which were at one time designed by a NA, have been modified and passed off as his work. People so affected were Art Defever, Bill Garden, Dave Perry, Bill Trip Sr. and Tom Lexas. Also my friend's designs were passed on to others and modifed with out his approval (or any royalities being paid). Look to the boats built in Asia.
Bob Austin
At 10:20 AM 1/14/05 -0500, you wrote:
builders who are not naval architects nor who employ naval
architects." I'll bet that designers who are not NAs engage one before
finalizing their designs. For one thing, to do otherwise would incur a
huge liability. For another, as a customer, I'd want that stamp on the
plans for my boat!
I think you will find that is not the case. Naval Architect is a whole
different ball game.
Mike
Capt. Mike Maurice
Tualatin(Portland), Oregon